Test tourney result.

[Leo Dijksman]

Geschrieben von: / Posted by: Leo Dijksman at 16 March 2004 12:04:55:

WinBoard 4.2.7, Windows200Pro, Dual CPU.
Hashtables set to 128MB as far possible.
Time: 40/5. Ponder=ON.
New engines/versions test 2
MP2600, 2004.03.15 - 2004.03.16
Score A D N G G Z H O T M P C
----------------------------------------------------------
1: Alarm 0.93.1 9.5 / 11 X = 0 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1
2: Djinn 0.849 9.0 / 11 = X = 1 1 1 1 1 0 1 1 1
3: Naum 1.0 8.5 / 11 1 = X 1 1 1 0 0 1 1 1 1
4: GNUChess 4TM 7.5 / 11 0 0 0 X = 1 1 1 1 1 1 1
5: GreKo 2.70 7.0 / 11 0 0 0 = X 1 = 1 1 1 1 1
6: ZZZZZZ 6.421 5.0 / 11 0 0 0 0 0 X 1 1 1 0 1 1
7: Hermann 0.9.4 4.5 / 11 0 0 1 0 = 0 X 0 0 1 1 1
8: OliThink 4.1.3 4.0 / 10 0 0 1 0 0 0 1 X 0 1 1 .
9: Tinker 4.47 3.5 / 11 0 1 0 0 0 0 1 1 X 0 = 0
10: Matheus 2.3 3.5 / 11 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 1 X = 1
11: Plywood 1.73 2.0 / 11 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 = = X 1
12: Celes 0.78 wbec7 1.0 / 10 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 . 1 0 0 X
----------------------------------------------------------
65 games: +36 =6 -23
Problems found:
One game is not played!?
Hermann lost 2 games on time, also "hangs" after 2 games!
Celes "hangs" after 3 games!
Plywood lost one game on time because he did not play after he _reject_ a drawoffer!??
lgpgnver 1.40:
File: NewengT2.pgn
Level of warnings: 0
=============================================================================
Game 57: GNUChess 4TM-Alarm 0.93.1
1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 d6 3. Bb5+ Bd7 4. a4 Nf6 5. d3 g6 6. Nc3 Nc6 7. h3 Bg7 8.
O-O O-O 9. Bd2 e5 10. Bc4 a6 11. Nd5 Nxd5 12. Bxd5 Rb8 13. Bg5 Qb6 14. Nd2
h6 15. Nc4 Qc7 16. Bd2 Nb4 17. Bxb4 cxb4 18. Qd2 Qc5 19. Qe3 b5 20. axb5
axb5 21. Ra7 Be6 22. Bxe6 fxe6 23. Qxc5 dxc5 24. Ne3 h5 25. Re7 Rfe8 26.
Rc7 Rec8 27. Rxc8+ Rxc8 28. g4 Ra8 29. Kg2 Ra2 30. Rb1 Kf7 31. gxh5 gxh5
32. c4 bxc4 33. Nxc4 Ra8 34. Rd1 Kf6 35. Kg3 Rd8 36. Kf3 Bh6 37. Ke2 Ra8
38. Rf1 Bg5 39. Nb6 Ra2 40. Rb1 Ke7 41. Nc4 Bf4 42. h4 Ra8 43. Rf1 Kf6 44.
Rd1 Ra2 45. Rb1 Ke7 46. Rh1 Kf7 47. Rf1 Ra6 48. Rb1 Kf6 49. Re1 Bh6 50.
Kf3 Ra8 51. Rb1 Ra2 52. Rg1 b3 53. Rg8 Bc1 54. Rf8+ Ke7 55. Rb8 Bxb2 56.
Rb7+ Kf6 57. Rxb3 Bd4 58. Ne3 Ra1 59. Rb8 Bxe3 60. Kxe3 Rh1 61. Rc8 Rxh4
62. Rxc5 Rh3+ 63. Ke2 h4 64. Rc1 Rh2 65. Rg1 Kf7 66. Rg5 Kf6 67. Rh5 Rh1
68. Kf3 Rh2 69. Ke3 Rh3+ 70. Kd2 Rh1 71. Ke2 Rh3 72. Rh7 Rh1 73. Kf3 Kg5
74. Rg7+ Kf6 75. Rb7 Rh2 76. Rd7 Kg6 77. Rd6 Kf7 78. Rd8 Kf6 79. Kg4 Ke7
80. Rh8 Rxf2 81. Rxh4 Rd2 82. Rh7+ Kd6 83. Rh8 Kc5 84. Rd8 Rf2 85. Kg3 Rf1
86. Kg2 Rf4 87. Rd7 Kc6 88. Ra7 Kc5 89. Ra4 Rf6 90. Rc4+ Kd6 91. Rc8 Rf7
92. Kg3 Rf6 93. Rc2 Rf1 94. Rc3 Rf7 95. Kg2 Rf8 96. Rc2 Rf6 97. Rc4 Rf8
98. Rc1 Rf4 99. Kg3 Rf6 100. Rc8 Rf4 101. Rd8+ Kc6 102. Ra8 Kc5 103. Ra4
Rf6 104. Rc4+ Kd6 105. Rc1 Rf8 106. Kg4 Rf4+ 107. Kh5 Rf3 108. Rc3 Rg3 109.
Ra3 Ke7 110. Rb3 Kf6 111. Rc3 Rg8 112. Kh4 Rg1 113. Kh3 Kg5 114. Kh2 Re1
115. Kg3 Re3+ 116. Kg2 Kf4 117. Kf2 Rh3 118. Kg2 Rh8 119. Rc5 Rd8 120. Rc3
Ke3 121. Rc5 Rg8+ 122. Kf1 Kxd3 123. Rxe5 Rg6 124. Ke1 Kd4 125. Rb5 Kxe4
126. Rb4+ Kf5 127. Ke2 e5 128. Kf3 Rh6 129. Kg3 Rd6 130. Kf2 e4 131. Ke3
Rd3+ 132. Ke2 Kf4 133. Rb8 Rd5 134. Rf8+ Rf5 135. Rxf5+ Kxf5 136. Kd2 Kf4
137. Ke2 e3 138. Ke1 Kf5 139. Ke2
Result :1/2-1/2 {Draw}
Warning level :3
Final position: 8/8/8/5k2/8/4p3/4K3/8 b - - 3 139
Analyze result:* {no draw found}
GNU claimed this draw, ofcourse the position is draw but
claiming it is not legal by the FIDE rules because the
_opponent_ have still a pawn (=mating material) on the board!
On the other hand it should save a lot of time at tournements/
matches which are played at longer timecontroles so maby it
should be accepted at computerchess? (IF it is a Kp-K draw position!)
The better way is to "offer/accept" draws in this Kp-K, KQ-KQ, KR-KR like
positions by my opinion (thats legal anyway ).
Also using egtbs helps a lot in this situations, then its finished in a
few seconds )
=============================================================================
Engine news:
New Engine: Elephant v1.00 (Be carefull, use around 150MB of your RAM!)
Best wishes,
Leo.



WBEC Ridderkerk homepage.

[Benny Antonsson]

Geschrieben von: / Posted by: Benny Antonsson at 16 March 2004 12:38:56:
Als Antwort auf: / In reply to: Test tourney result. geschrieben von: / posted by: Leo Dijksman at 16 March 2004 12:04:55:

Great result for Alarm Are the games available ?

[Tom Likens]

Geschrieben von: / Posted by: Tom Likens at 16 March 2004 13:21:52:
Als Antwort auf: / In reply to: Re: Test tourney result. geschrieben von: / posted by: Benny Antonsson at 16 March 2004 12:38:56:

Great result for Alarm Are the games available ?

Yes, it was a great result for Alarm. In fact, it was rather "alarming"!
Sorry, couldn't resist.
--tom

[Leo Dijksman]

Geschrieben von: / Posted by: Leo Dijksman at 16 March 2004 13:34:41:
Als Antwort auf: / In reply to: Re: Test tourney result. geschrieben von: / posted by: Benny Antonsson at 16 March 2004 12:38:56:

Great result for Alarm Are the games available ?

Congratulated Benny!
The games are underway,
Leo


WBEC Ridderkerk homepage.

[Slobodan R. Stojanovic]

Geschrieben von: / Posted by: Slobodan R. Stojanovic at 16 March 2004 13:52:04:
Als Antwort auf: / In reply to: Test tourney result. geschrieben von: / posted by: Leo Dijksman at 16 March 2004 12:04:55:

Final position: 8/8/8/5k2/8/4p3/4K3/8 b - - 3 139
Analyze result:* {no draw found}
GNU claimed this draw, ofcourse the position is draw but
claiming it is not legal by the FIDE rules because the
_opponent_ have still a pawn (=mating material) on the board!
On the other hand it should save a lot of time at tournements/
matches which are played at longer timecontroles so maby it
should be accepted at computerchess? (IF it is a Kp-K draw position!)
The better way is to "offer/accept" draws in this Kp-K, KQ-KQ, KR-KR like
positions by my opinion (thats legal anyway ).
Also using egtbs helps a lot in this situations, then its finished in a
few seconds )
=============================================================================
Engine news:
New Engine: Elephant v1.00 (Be carefull, use around 150MB of your RAM!)
Best wishes,
Leo.

I think you shouldn´t be dogmatic and apply all FIDE rules in case of engines games. Because engines use Opening books and EGTBs in tournaments, althought it is not allowed by FIDE rules for human players.
You have all credencials to be a WBEC judge in your WBEC tournaments, and there is no reason to waste your time with deadly draw positions.
But if you don´t want to be WBEC judge (referee), be a conscience user and adjudicate draw games ("User adjudication" in Arena GUI).
Best. SL.

[Leo Dijksman]

Geschrieben von: / Posted by: Leo Dijksman at 16 March 2004 15:38:45:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Test tourney result. geschrieben von: / posted by: Slobodan R. Stojanovic at 16 March 2004 13:52:04:

Final position: 8/8/8/5k2/8/4p3/4K3/8 b - - 3 139
Analyze result:* {no draw found}
GNU claimed this draw, ofcourse the position is draw but
claiming it is not legal by the FIDE rules because the
_opponent_ have still a pawn (=mating material) on the board!
On the other hand it should save a lot of time at tournements/
matches which are played at longer timecontroles so maby it
should be accepted at computerchess? (IF it is a Kp-K draw position!)
The better way is to "offer/accept" draws in this Kp-K, KQ-KQ, KR-KR like
positions by my opinion (thats legal anyway ).
Also using egtbs helps a lot in this situations, then its finished in a
few seconds )
=============================================================================
Engine news:
New Engine: Elephant v1.00 (Be carefull, use around 150MB of your RAM!)
Best wishes,
Leo.

I think you shouldn´t be dogmatic and apply all FIDE rules in case of engines games. Because engines use Opening books and EGTBs in tournaments, althought it is not allowed by FIDE rules for human players.
You have all credencials to be a WBEC judge in your WBEC tournaments, and there is no reason to waste your time with deadly draw positions.
But if you don´t want to be WBEC judge (referee), be a conscience user and adjudicate draw games ("User adjudication" in Arena GUI).
Best. SL.

I dont see "WBEC" at my message, its a test tourney and the draw question was about "FIDE rules" and "computerchess", not specific to WBEC Ridderkerk!
So I dont see why you speak about WBEC Ridderkerk at this point.
In the first place I dont use Arena for WBEC Ridderkerk but WinBoard, in the second place I dont think Arena adjudicate Kp vs K, KR vs KR or KQ vs KQ as draw, am I right?
Best wishes,
Leo.




WBEC Ridderkerk homepage.

[Slobodan R. Stojanovic]

Geschrieben von: / Posted by: Slobodan R. Stojanovic at 16 March 2004 16:06:10:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Test tourney result. geschrieben von: / posted by: Leo Dijksman at 16 March 2004 15:38:45:

Final position: 8/8/8/5k2/8/4p3/4K3/8 b - - 3 139
Analyze result:* {no draw found}
GNU claimed this draw, ofcourse the position is draw but
claiming it is not legal by the FIDE rules because the
_opponent_ have still a pawn (=mating material) on the board!
On the other hand it should save a lot of time at tournements/
matches which are played at longer timecontroles so maby it
should be accepted at computerchess? (IF it is a Kp-K draw position!)
The better way is to "offer/accept" draws in this Kp-K, KQ-KQ, KR-KR like
positions by my opinion (thats legal anyway ).
Also using egtbs helps a lot in this situations, then its finished in a
few seconds )
=============================================================================
Engine news:
New Engine: Elephant v1.00 (Be carefull, use around 150MB of your RAM!)
Best wishes,
Leo.

I think you shouldn´t be dogmatic and apply all FIDE rules in case of engines games. Because engines use Opening books and EGTBs in tournaments, althought it is not allowed by FIDE rules for human players.
You have all credencials to be a WBEC judge in your WBEC tournaments, and there is no reason to waste your time with deadly draw positions.
But if you don´t want to be WBEC judge (referee), be a conscience user and adjudicate draw games ("User adjudication" in Arena GUI).
Best. SL.

I dont see "WBEC" at my message, its a test tourney and the draw question was about "FIDE rules" and "computerchess", not specific to WBEC Ridderkerk!
So I dont see why you speak about WBEC Ridderkerk at this point.
In the first place I dont use Arena for WBEC Ridderkerk but WinBoard, in the second place I dont think Arena adjudicate Kp vs K, KR vs KR or KQ vs KQ as draw, am I right?
Best wishes,
Leo.

If my avaliation is the same as avaliations of both engines, I adjudicate draw´positions as draw games in longer time controls. In these situations I am "FIDE rule" for them. But, as I´ve said, I consider both engines´ opinion as well.
Best. SL.

[Leo Dijksman]

Geschrieben von: / Posted by: Leo Dijksman at 16 March 2004 17:04:09:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Test tourney result. geschrieben von: / posted by: Slobodan R. Stojanovic at 16 March 2004 16:06:10:

Final position: 8/8/8/5k2/8/4p3/4K3/8 b - - 3 139
Analyze result:* {no draw found}
GNU claimed this draw, ofcourse the position is draw but
claiming it is not legal by the FIDE rules because the
_opponent_ have still a pawn (=mating material) on the board!
On the other hand it should save a lot of time at tournements/
matches which are played at longer timecontroles so maby it
should be accepted at computerchess? (IF it is a Kp-K draw position!)
The better way is to "offer/accept" draws in this Kp-K, KQ-KQ, KR-KR like
positions by my opinion (thats legal anyway ).
Also using egtbs helps a lot in this situations, then its finished in a
few seconds )
=============================================================================
Engine news:
New Engine: Elephant v1.00 (Be carefull, use around 150MB of your RAM!)
Best wishes,
Leo.

I think you shouldn´t be dogmatic and apply all FIDE rules in case of engines games. Because engines use Opening books and EGTBs in tournaments, althought it is not allowed by FIDE rules for human players.
You have all credencials to be a WBEC judge in your WBEC tournaments, and there is no reason to waste your time with deadly draw positions.
But if you don´t want to be WBEC judge (referee), be a conscience user and adjudicate draw games ("User adjudication" in Arena GUI).
Best. SL.

I dont see "WBEC" at my message, its a test tourney and the draw question was about "FIDE rules" and "computerchess", not specific to WBEC Ridderkerk!
So I dont see why you speak about WBEC Ridderkerk at this point.
In the first place I dont use Arena for WBEC Ridderkerk but WinBoard, in the second place I dont think Arena adjudicate Kp vs K, KR vs KR or KQ vs KQ as draw, am I right?
Best wishes,
Leo.

If my avaliation is the same as avaliations of both engines, I adjudicate draw´positions as draw games in longer time controls. In these situations I am "FIDE rule" for them. But, as I´ve said, I consider both engines´ opinion as well.
Best. SL.

I got it, thats the same as I do then.
The 'problem' is that I am not always available to do so (work, sleep)
Therefore it should be good to have some "computer chess" rules which replace Fide rules for CC to make them "legal" for all CC tourneys by my opinion.
In that case they could be implemented in all engines, the problem would be the interfaces because they are used for both, human and computerchess.
Best wishes,
Leo.


WBEC Ridderkerk homepage.