Crafty 19.15

[Roger Brown]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Roger Brown at 07 July 2004 20:17:33:

Hello all,
On Peter Skinner's website there can be found a folder containing Crafty 19.15 zip files.
I cannot open them here but perhaps some intrepid soul could have a look and let us know if this is really a pre-release of the version of the engine playing at the Chess Championships.
Later.

[David Dahlem]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: David Dahlem at 07 July 2004 21:05:10:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Crafty 19.15 geschrieben von:/posted by: Roger Brown at 07 July 2004 20:17:33:

Hello all,
On Peter Skinner's website there can be found a folder containing Crafty 19.15 zip files.
I cannot open them here but perhaps some intrepid soul could have a look and let us know if this is really a pre-release of the version of the engine playing at the Chess Championships.
Later.

According to Peters post on CCC, he has a new URL ...
http://www.webkikr.com
And i don't see any Crafty downloads at this website. Where did you find a download for Crafty 19.15?
Thanks
Dave

[Roger Brown]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Roger Brown at 07 July 2004 21:27:23:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Crafty 19.15 geschrieben von:/posted by: David Dahlem at 07 July 2004 21:05:10:

And i don't see any Crafty downloads at this website. Where did you find a download for Crafty 19.15?
Thanks
Dave

Hello Dave,
As Alice would say, "Mysterious and mysteriouser"
I cannot find them now yet I do have them sitting on my hard-drive here.
Shrug.
Later.
Ps. Give Peter a few hours to get the site up to speed. He is a CCC regular so perhaps a discreet enquiry there would clear things up.
Later, again.

[Peter Skinner]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Peter Skinner at 08. July 2004 04:34:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Crafty 19.15 geschrieben von:/posted by: Roger Brown at 07 July 2004 21:27:23:

And i don't see any Crafty downloads at this website. Where did you find a download for Crafty 19.15?
Thanks
Dave

Hello Dave,
As Alice would say, "Mysterious and mysteriouser"
I cannot find them now yet I do have them sitting on my hard-drive here.
Shrug.
Later.
Ps. Give Peter a few hours to get the site up to speed. He is a CCC regular so perhaps a discreet enquiry there would clear things up.
Later, again.

Well the folder that contained the 19.15 zip files was removed on Saturday.
Robert Hyatt gave me the source to compile for Peter Berger, but was never released on my site.
It was in a hidden folder, and only myself, Robert, and Peter Berger knew of.
So unless you somehow got a directory listing of my site, there is no way you could have found them.
Seeing as you do have them, as you state, I am a tad suspicious.
Peter Skinner



Crafty HomePage

[Roger Brown]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Roger Brown at 08 July 2004 06:03:41:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Crafty 19.15 geschrieben von:/posted by: Roger Brown at 07 July 2004 21:27:23:

Hello Dave and Peter,
I checked and yes, the Crafty 19.15 engines are here on my machine.
No, I will not issue them to anyone if there is some problem. You can rest assured on that point. Not until the build is made public.
No, I did not hack anyone's website (no interest, less skill) but I do have an insatiable hunger for information....and WB engines. I manage to find them in the oddest of places.
Stuff happens.
Later.

[Peter Skinner]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Peter Skinner at 08 July 2004 06:59:32:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Crafty 19.15...identity confirmed. geschrieben von:/posted by: Roger Brown at 08 July 2004 06:03:41:

Hello Dave and Peter,
I checked and yes, the Crafty 19.15 engines are here on my machine.
No, I will not issue them to anyone if there is some problem. You can rest assured on that point. Not until the build is made public.
No, I did not hack anyone's website (no interest, less skill) but I do have an insatiable hunger for information....and WB engines. I manage to find them in the oddest of places.
Stuff happens.
Later.

I am totally baffled how you could have recieved them off my server.
Looking at my log files from the server, the directory was deleted on Saturday July 3, 2004 at 4:11 pm server time.
2 32427 webkikr 1024 Jul 2 16:50 .
17 32427 99 2048 Jul 7 18:38 ..
1 32427 webkikr 313329 Jul 3 16:11 wcrafty-19.15-SMP.rar
1 32427 webkikr 305978 Jul 3 16:11 wcrafty-19.15-SSE-SMP.rar
1 32427 webkikr 295368 Jul 3 16:11 wcrafty-19.15-SSE-nonsmp.rar
1 32427 webkikr 261189 Jul 3 16:11 wcrafty-19.15-SSE2-SMP.rar
1 32427 webkikr 251075 Jul 3 16:11 wcrafty-19.15-SSE2-nonsmp.rar
1 32427 webkikr 212360 Jul 3 16:50 wcrafty-19.15-SSE2-pgo.rar
1 32427 webkikr 301257 Jul 3 16:11 wcrafty-19.15-nonsmp.rar
1 32427 webkikr 244537 Jul 3 16:33 wcrafty-19.15-pgo.rar
It also shows that there were _zero_ downloads of these files.
So again I must state I am baffled as to how you downloaded them, unless you did it between Friday night, and Saturday afternoon, and _somehow_ got a directory listing of my server.
Since you state you are in possession of the files, I am hoping you will just delete them, as they are not the final release of 19.15, and is not the exact copy of what is playing in Israel.
Robert has stated he maybe releasing the final version on Thursday.
Peter

[Roger Brown]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Roger Brown at 08 July 2004 07:26:59:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Crafty 19.15...identity confirmed. geschrieben von:/posted by: Peter Skinner at 08 July 2004 06:59:32:

I am totally baffled how you could have recieved them off my server.
Looking at my log files from the server, the directory was deleted on Saturday July 3, 2004 at 4:11 pm server time.
2 32427 webkikr 1024 Jul 2 16:50 .
17 32427 99 2048 Jul 7 18:38 ..
1 32427 webkikr 313329 Jul 3 16:11 wcrafty-19.15-SMP.rar
1 32427 webkikr 305978 Jul 3 16:11 wcrafty-19.15-SSE-SMP.rar
1 32427 webkikr 295368 Jul 3 16:11 wcrafty-19.15-SSE-nonsmp.rar
1 32427 webkikr 261189 Jul 3 16:11 wcrafty-19.15-SSE2-SMP.rar
1 32427 webkikr 251075 Jul 3 16:11 wcrafty-19.15-SSE2-nonsmp.rar
1 32427 webkikr 212360 Jul 3 16:50 wcrafty-19.15-SSE2-pgo.rar
1 32427 webkikr 301257 Jul 3 16:11 wcrafty-19.15-nonsmp.rar
1 32427 webkikr 244537 Jul 3 16:33 wcrafty-19.15-pgo.rar
It also shows that there were _zero_ downloads of these files.
So again I must state I am baffled as to how you downloaded them, unless you did it between Friday night, and Saturday afternoon, and _somehow_ got a directory listing of my server.
Since you state you are in possession of the files, I am hoping you will just delete them, as they are not the final release of 19.15, and is not the exact copy of what is playing in Israel.
Robert has stated he maybe releasing the final version on Thursday.
Peter

Your bafflement in no way compares to mine. I visited your old site on the odd occasion to obtain your Crafty builds and books. Then I saw a post by you that the site had moved and been changed.
I went there and saw the Lundsen book, an Apple chessbase book file and the Crafty 19.15 engines. I said hey, maybe these are a pre-release and took them down.
I did not think I had anything to hide so I downloaded them and announced HERE that I had done so. Hardly the work of a malcontent.
Then I became aware of a discussion between yourself and Dave Dahelm on the CCC wherein the absence of those files - I went back to look and could not find them at all (and again admitted same in public) - was causing some consternation.

I am going to gently suggest that you there is an explanation that does not involving me having any computer abilities whatsoever. Most importantly, I am not a thief. Nor is my desire for engines that are going to be released publicly anyway so great that I would resort to extra-ordinary means to possess them.
FLAME ONI do not have a directory listing for your server. I have no ***** idea what such a listing looks like. If it fell in a plate of food I was consuming I would call the waiter to remove the plate and serve me a new meal. I do not recall when I downloaded them but it would have been close to when I posted about my find...in all innocence of course.
You have proof that I have your directory listing - whatever that is - then bring it here Peter. You have my e-mail so you can post your insinuations there if you like. Odd that I would ensure that you were issued a password so you could post here if I had something to hide, isn't it?
Have you ever heard of security holes? Check your server logs again. I have absolutely no computer/internet skill (not true, I do know how to connect Crafty to Winboard but I can follow directions) and I did something you think requires it. I think you may have a security problem at your end.FLAME OFF
I fail to see your point here. Yes, all you had to do was ask but whether it is the version playing there or not is scarcely important. Consider the deletions done.
Yaaaayyyy!! All my hard work for naught. Shucks. Just makes me feel silly.
The tone of your (yet) unreleased post is something I cannot wait to sink my fangs into.
Later.

[Roger Brown]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Roger Brown at 08 July 2004 07:57:58:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Crafty 19.15 geschrieben von:/posted by: Peter Skinner at 08. July 2004 04:34:

Well the folder that contained the 19.15 zip files was removed on Saturday.
Robert Hyatt gave me the source to compile for Peter Berger, but was never released on my site.
It was in a hidden folder, and only myself, Robert, and Peter Berger knew of.
So unless you somehow got a directory listing of my site, there is no way you could have found them.
Seeing as you do have them, as you state, I am a tad suspicious.

I have no idea whether or not the folder was hidden. I went on your site and they were all in a bunch. I downloaded them. I can ensure that I did not have any passwords or listings for your site. My internet skills are limited to pointing at a file, clicking on it, save as..... You get the picture I am sure.
Until you mentioned it here, I did not know you could hide files. Astonishing but true.


I have no such listing. I have no clue what it is. I am not the slightest bit interested in going through extra-ordinary lengths to get something that is going to be offered freely by the author anyway.
I have tons of engines on my hard-drive. Betas that have never seen the light of day. Commercial engines in the dozens. No that is not a mis-print. Steal Crafty? I have downloaded several versions of that engine. From you, Dann Corbit, Slater Wold, Leo Dijksman etc. I even have a couple of ancient versions I donated so that collectors such as myself could enjoy them.
You have made rather a mess of my reputation in the meantime Peter. A real mess. An apology would be appreciated. Perhaps not expected, as you have carelessly accused me without a shred of evidence, but it would be appreciated nontheless.
Let us see if you have the guts....

I wish I could tell you what to do with your suspicions but I refuse to sink to that level.
Prove what you say. Put up or......
I am thinking that perhaps in all the moving of files between the site and the initial loading problems you were having that things got a wee bit chaotic? Perhaps a hidden file became available? An accident?
It must have been something like that because I do not have the requisite mind-set or skill set.
I await the aplogy but I am not going to hold my breath. Next time I steal something I hope I have the sense that God gave a monkey and not post the fact of that theft in full public view. That was sarcasm.

You know, if you had just asked me to erase the files without the careless accusations and innuendo I would have happily complied. I am a huge Crafty fan (alright, so I am crazy about the Baron, sue me!).
I am at heart an honest man.

I am genuinely sorry it went like this because you could have given me the benefit of the doubt before you carelessly posted your suspicions.
I am bitterly disappointed.

Later.

[Peter Skinner]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Peter Skinner at 08 July 2004 08:06:35:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Crafty 19.15...identity confirmed. geschrieben von:/posted by: Roger Brown at 08 July 2004 07:26:59:

Your bafflement in no way compares to mine. I visited your old site on the odd occasion to obtain your Crafty builds and books. Then I saw a post by you that the site had moved and been changed.
I went there and saw the Lundsen book, an Apple chessbase book file and the Crafty 19.15 engines. I said hey, maybe these are a pre-release and took them down.
Well that is odd, as the lunsen book, and the apple book were in the main directory, and the v19.15 files were in a different folder. So to see both in the same place is _impossible_.
I did not think I had anything to hide so I downloaded them and announced HERE that I had done so. Hardly the work of a malcontent.
Then I became aware of a discussion between yourself and Dave Dahelm on the CCC wherein the absence of those files - I went back to look and could not find them at all (and again admitted same in public) - was causing some consternation.
Yes I saw your posts about getting the files, and then suddenly not being able to find them. When _exactly_ did you download them?

I am going to gently suggest that you there is an explanation that does not involving me having any computer abilities whatsoever. Most importantly, I am not a thief. Nor is my desire for engines that are going to be released publicly anyway so great that I would resort to extra-ordinary means to possess them.
There maybe another explanation, but so far what you state and what was actually there are two _different_ things.
You have proof that I have your directory listing - whatever that is - then bring it here Peter. You have my e-mail so you can post your insinuations there if you like. Odd that I would ensure that you were issued a password so you could post here if I had something to hide, isn't it?
Well it is fine that you ensured I had a password to respond here. I wouldn't expect anything less.
Have you ever heard of security holes?
Actually I have heard of security holes, and one of the main reasons I move d away from the phpnuke system was because of exploits, and actually one that took place. That exploit however was _not_ successful as I had already patched that hole.
I fail to see your point here. Yes, all you had to do was ask but whether it is the version playing there or not is scarcely important. Consider the deletions done.
My point was someone is in possession of files that were not openly available from my website. The lunsen book and apple book were in the root of the _crafty_ subdomain, and the v19.15 files were in fact in the main root. Two completely different places. That is why I have a problem with the fact you have the files. Two sets of files in two totally separate places, yet you have both sets.. now do you see my point? And I can prove it..
This is an email between Robert Hyatt and myself on Friday July 2, 6:02pm MST:
Also I compiled many different ones, and they can be found at:
http://www.webkikr.com/wccc
I almost send this message to the general list
That would have been a BIG oops..
Peter
-----Original Message-----
From: Robert M. Hyatt [mailto:hyatt@cis.uab.edu]
Sent: Friday, July 02, 2004 4:36 PM
To: Peter Skinner
Subject: RE: Crafty v19.15

I sent this last night. Something must have gone wrong...

--
Robert M. Hyatt, Ph.D. Computer and Information Sciences
hyatt@uab.edu University of Alabama at Birmingham
(205) 934-2213 136A Campbell Hall
(205) 934-5473 FAX Birmingham, AL 35294-1170

As you can see the v19.15 builds where in a different location on the server, in fact they were in the /root folder. The lunsen database and apple database where in the /root/crafty/...
Yaaaayyyy!! All my hard work for naught. Shucks. Just makes me feel silly.
The tone of your (yet) unreleased post is something I cannot wait to sink my fangs into.
Later.
Sink away.. go crazy..

[Roger Brown]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Roger Brown at 08 July 2004 08:59:30:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Crafty 19.15...identity confirmed. geschrieben von:/posted by: Peter Skinner at 08 July 2004 08:06:35:

I went there and saw the Lundsen book, an Apple chessbase book file and the Crafty 19.15 engines. I said hey, maybe these are a pre-release and took them down.
Well that is odd, as the lunsen book, and the apple book were in the main directory, and the v19.15 files were in a different folder. So to see both in the same place is _impossible_.
Yes I saw your posts about getting the files, and then suddenly not being able to find them. When _exactly_ did you download them?
There maybe another explanation, but so far what you state and what was actually there are two _different_ things.
Well it is fine that you ensured I had a password to respond here. I wouldn't expect anything less.
My point was someone is in possession of files that were not openly available from my website. The lunsen book and apple book were in the root of the _crafty_ subdomain, and the v19.15 files were in fact in the main root. Two completely different places. That is why I have a problem with the fact you have the files. Two sets of files in two totally separate places, yet you have both sets.. now do you see my point? And I can prove it..

Hmmmm, read again. I said I went to your site and the files where there. I wish I had noted the folder name but the Crafties were not in the same folder as the books. There were about four or so versions - do not hold me to the exact number as I had no interest in taking an inventory - in a folder.
I downloaded those with the same ease I downloaded the books. In the same session. No password or special keys required. Point, click and download. I wish I was able to do the things you suggest. I am deliberating the establishing of a web site to present aspects of a course I am teaching but I have no clue so I am going to have to pay an undergrad science wizard to do my work for me.
Sigh.

Check the Forum. At the start of this Crafty thread (the one Dave responded to) I posted that I had downloaded the files. The timestamp for the post should be there. I would estimate that I downloaded the files about an hour before the post so the exact time should not be hard to compute.

I cannot help you there. I know what I did Peter. I also know that I did not do anything re your directory listing. I have no clue what that is. Still don't except now I know that it something that enables someone to take stuff from a page without permission.
The Crafty files - all of them were rar files I believe - were in blue text. I clicked on them and saved them to my harddrive at work. I could not open them there so I wondered aloud at the Forum if anyone else had downloaded them and checked if this was crafty 19.15.
Think about this Peter. I was practically inviting a horde of persons to go to your site to download Crafty 19.15. I told them the files were there. Doesn't it strike you as a wee bit strange that I would set myself up for exposure? It seems strange to me. Maybe I am telling the the truth and I downloaded a bunch of files that were not hidden to me.
What is so sad about this is that if someone else has managed this they are not going to come forward. I admit that it looks like a large pill to swallow but I realy went to your site and downloaded the files. I does not make sense but it is the flat truth.
Fair enough.

Without getting into the details of this e-mail, I believe I have corrected your assumption about the files being all in one folder. I never said that. They were all on your site, in different but very visible - they were not hidden or anything - folders. I did not encounter any problems in clicking on them and downloading them. They were NOT hidden.
I am going to repeat this a million times. I have absolutely no clue about the folder being hidden or protected or requiring a directory, key or password. I have enough challenges password protecting a word document.

I have no interest in the e-mail as it does not affect what I have been saying. I am not only not mentally/spiritually suited to be any sort of hacker, I simply do not possess the skills. Two minutes after meeting me you would believe that too. I need help to get Inbetween to run with the King.
Lots of help.


Peter, this matter is getting more serious by the minute. I am telling you and I will tell you with a lie detector strapped, I will tell you if you wake me up forty times in the night, I will tell you if you ask me one million times, those files were not hidden when I downloaded them. You say you deleted them over the week-end past.
I cannot explain that. I have absolutely no clue as to how files you deleted - and hid in any event - ended up being available. I have no idea. You say your security issues are over. So be it.
I say that I downloaded four files. They would have been non smp versions as I have a single processor here. Those four files were rar files. They contained Crafties. Version 19.15.
I do not know you but I tell you this:
I went to your site, downloaded the books, went to another folder and downloaded the Crafty engines. They were not hidden. They were in a stack and they were not files but blue text that I clicked on and saved to the harddrive. I hope that I have not just spoke rubbish by referring to blue text but I am telling you exactly what I saw. They were not zip files- objects like cabinets - but blue lines describing the particulars of each engine.
Does that make sense?

There is an explanation that does not require me doing anything dishonest and/or illegal. Find it because it is the truth. I am asking you to do that for me. Even though you know there could be no other explanation. Even though you are sure of your facts. Even though nothing else makes sense - find one.

For me.

Later.

[Dann Corbit]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Dann Corbit at 08 July 2004 19:51:02:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Crafty 19.15...identity confirmed. geschrieben von:/posted by: Peter Skinner at 08 July 2004 08:06:35:

mget * will pull files from subdirectories at times, including hidden subdirectories.
I suspect you had read permissions for the folder set to world.
The very thought of Roger Brown as the skulking hacker and "warez d00d" is rather commical to me.



my ftp site {remove http:// unless you like error messages}

[Dave Kuntzsch]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Dave Kuntzsch at 08. July 2004 20:00:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Crafty 19.15 geschrieben von:/posted by: Roger Brown at 07 July 2004 20:17:33:

Hello all,
On Peter Skinner's website there can be found a folder containing Crafty 19.15 zip files.
I cannot open them here but perhaps some intrepid soul could have a look and let us know if this is really a pre-release of the version of the engine playing at the Chess Championships.
Later.

I agree with what you're saying Roger. Yesterday about 13:00 CDT, when I accessed the new site, I was presented with an FTP directory listing, not an HTML page. I only looked at what was in that directory and cannot absolutely verify 19.15 was in another directory, but what I saw were several different compiles of 19.14 in combinations of SMP, non-SMP, SSE, SSE2. They're not to be found today. Something weird was happening, but I can't guess what it was.
Dave

[Roger Brown]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Roger Brown at 08 July 2004 20:33:20:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Crafty 19.15...identity confirmed. geschrieben von:/posted by: Dann Corbit at 08 July 2004 19:51:02:

mget * will pull files from subdirectories at times, including hidden subdirectories.
I suspect you had read permissions for the folder set to world.
The very thought of Roger Brown as the skulking hacker and "warez d00d" is rather commical to me.

Hello Dann,

More than words can say, thanks a lot.

Ps. Of course if you are laughing at my internet and computer skills....go right ahead. I am a technophobe. I confess it.


Thanks Dann, it is good to see it in print.

Later.

[Peter Skinner]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Peter Skinner at 08 July 2004 21:01:34:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Crafty 19.15...identity confirmed. geschrieben von:/posted by: Dann Corbit at 08 July 2004 19:51:02:

mget * will pull files from subdirectories at times, including hidden subdirectories.
I suspect you had read permissions for the folder set to world.
The very thought of Roger Brown as the skulking hacker and "warez d00d" is rather commical to me.

Actually no the permissions were set correctly. Only the admin could see them.
I had asked Peter to register on the site, so he could do a number of things.. one being download those files.
This is a dead issue to me now. I tightened security on the server, and will no longer be an issue.
Peter

[Roger Brown]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Roger Brown at 08 July 2004 21:43:57:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Crafty 19.15...identity confirmed. geschrieben von:/posted by: Peter Skinner at 08 July 2004 21:01:34:

This is a dead issue to me now. I tightened security on the server, and will no longer be an issue.
Peter

Hello Peter,
I am happy that the issue is dead and that security has been tightened.
However, there is the small matter of you casting various insinuations in my direction, insisting that I had access to things I should not have had access to.
Are you content to leave those hanging out there?
Or is it of no concern to you what effect your words may have? You are a respected member of the CCC. Your posts carry weight. Would it be too much to ask that you at least lift the burden of proof from my innocent shoulders?
That is all I am asking.
I wish your revamped site every success and I look forward to tons of future downloads. Without all of this heat of course.
Later.

[Peter Skinner]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Peter Skinner at 09 July 2004 00:21:48:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Crafty 19.15...identity confirmed. geschrieben von:/posted by: Roger Brown at 08 July 2004 21:43:57:


Hello Peter,
I am happy that the issue is dead and that security has been tightened.
However, there is the small matter of you casting various insinuations in my direction, insisting that I had access to things I should not have had access to.
You are absolutely right, you did have _possession_ of items you were not supposed to have access to..
Are you content to leave those hanging out there?
No I am not, and you will see further in this post.
Or is it of no concern to you what effect your words may have? You are a respected member of the CCC. Your posts carry weight.
Well for one, I am hardly a "respected" member of the CCC. I just happen to host the Crafty website, and have given webspace to others that required better hosting options. Like the authors-only tournament. None of my posts at the CCC carry weight at all, unless I am announcing a new build of a Crafty version. Did you happen to see how badly I did in the moderators elections there? A chimp would have done better IMHO

Would it be too much to ask that you at least lift the burden of proof from my innocent shoulders? That is all I am asking.
And I shall take the burden away. Since I can find no proof the server was tampered with, and there is _no_ possible way for you to guess/crack my password, I have come to the conclusion there must have been a bug/fluke/blip in the system, and the downloads were readily available for _anyone_ to take.
I may have been quick to jump the gun, as there was an exploit tried on the server, then I hear of you having files that you should not have.
So I am sorry, truely I am that I implicated you in some grand scheme to obtain those files without permission or access.
I hope that suffices your need to be absolved...
Peter

[Roger Brown]

Geschrieben von:/Posted by: Roger Brown at 09 July 2004 02:10:35:
Als Antwort auf:/In reply to: Re: Crafty 19.15...identity confirmed. geschrieben von:/posted by: Peter Skinner at 09 July 2004 00:21:48: